View Full Version : Electronic Takfir - Is it the same thing?
29-06-2005, 10:13 AM
Much has been made on this forum of the fundamentalist tendency to make takfir on those members who claim to be Muslim yet express views or beliefs which are believed to take them out of the fold of Islam. And of course a warning has been given that incorrectly making takfir on someone can lead to that person leaving the fold os Islam themselves.
Question is, does making takfir on an anonymous person on a web forum count, as that person's identity is unknown, so people's perception of them as a Muslim isn't actually changed?
Are there any knowledgeable persons who can explain what constitutes takfir, when it can be made and what knowledge of aqeeda is necessary to make it.
And in relation to our own situation, are there any incidents historically when takfir was made on people who's identity was unknown?
13-07-2005, 02:08 PM
I can't think why nobody replied to this post. This is a very valid point. Very close to home indeed. Personally i think nobody should proclaim takfeer on anyone claiming to be muslim without conclusive proof of hypocrisy. Especially not on mere differences in opinion. There is only one judgement day and Allah will be that judge. However i am not sure of the actual islamic rulings.
13-07-2005, 02:37 PM
True. I've been takfeered several times now in public and private. Someone takfeered the whole of MPAC the other day.
The question is whether our community here is equal to the community outside. If someone pointed to me in a mosque and called me an unbeliever, would it be any worse than making the same accusation here in front of my brothers and sisters in this forum? Is your perception of me and my arguments not changed by this accusation?
Accusing someone on a forum is particularily cowardly. I think one of the reasons we all forget our adab here is because we don't see the hurt in our fellow Muslim's eyes when we become abusive. I wonder if they would be as willing to takfeer me to my face, with all the risks that entails. I know if anyone called me a Zionist to my face as they have done online, I would find it difficult to contain my anger. Takfeering me bothers me less - whoever does it puts himself beyond Islam and his judge will be the best of judges.
13-07-2005, 02:53 PM
I think one of the reasons we all forget our adab here is because we don't see the hurt in our fellow Muslim's eyes when we become abusive.
14-07-2005, 12:47 PM
I think the fact that nobody has replied, including the takfeerers themselves indicates that little is known about takfeer and is probably used as a last resort to a failed argument.
14-07-2005, 01:07 PM
Raashid, your right when you say takfeer is used as a last resort in any argument.
E-Takfeer is the same as Takfeer, just as E-porn is the same as porn. Its all about intentions.
//and for the record i've been takfeered so many times i've lost count.
15-07-2005, 04:37 PM
i could never takfeer anyone...(accept maybe really out there 'muslims' like IRshad Manji and Pallazi....but even the so called progressives like PMU and MWU are still Muslim...actually im not so sure, what about people like Amir Taheri and foud Ajami, Steven Swartz, Kabbani these are very dodgy people....they are so anti-Ummah and such neo cons i cannot consider them muslims.....ok i know that know thats not electronic takfeering...i got carried away..sorry
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